Lost: 02/14/07 - What the...? You Can't Go Hume...

[Tabby Lavalamp]

What the...?

[TinkerbellAPixie]

I loved it!

[DickeyD]

Did anyone else notice the song Charlie was singing in Desmond's flashback?

"But maybe
Your going to be the one that saves me
And after all,
You're my Wonderwall."

---Wonderwall, by OASIS



Little foreshadowing perhaps?

[Jinger]

I. Am. So. Fucking. Confused.

Seriously...what was that!? I don't get it!! I am a little drunk but really...WTF!?? Desmond's flashback he remembers things!? He is traveling through time!? And Charlie dies!? Actually...wait, Charlie dies, that's a good thing! OK, I'm good.

NO, seriously...WTF!?!?

[chooch850]

WOW..... what a great episode!!!!!
I just wonder how far into the future Desmond really is.

[Chris]

Oh my goodness. Seriously, this LOST just took everything, turned it upside down, and shook vigorously. I thought the whole Desmond thing was just cheesy, but of course, they made it work.

The old English woman? WHOA. Who is she?
Charlie's going to die?! Wow. Dominic must be pissed.
And did Desmond's physicist friend mention his odd behavior to Penelope after he left, causing her to start looking for him on the island, MAKING SENSE OF WHAT WE SAW AT THE END OF LAST SEASON?!?!

Someone unscramble my brain.

[animalcrackers]

i thought this was such a great episode!! when that english woman said "no you dont buy the ring - you have second thoughts!" i was like WTF! whats going on?!? i want to know if she is on the island too? is she an other? and then when she explain about the universe course correcting, Lost totally had me because my first thought was that claire was going to die. and i was sad because she has that baby and all. and then when desmond told charlie that he was sorry because its been him all along that he has been trying to save - WHOA. didnt see that one coming. (maybe other people did, and they can make fun of me all they want to... but i have been really good at staying away from the spoilers this time around)

anyways, i thought this episode did a good job at answering some of our questions. and next episode looks like it will do the same -about the children and other people that the Others took from camp and what they are doing now. i am sooo excited! is it wednesday yet??

[Jinger]

I hated hated hated this episode! I don't feel like there were any questions answered at all and am more confused that before. So he actually was able to physically be in the past for this part of his life...what is that supposed to mean?

Maybe I need to rewatch sober. Or maybe I need all the Lost Gasmers to help me understand what answers were just given cuz I didn't feel like I got any!

[J.D.H.]

Could it be that Charlie was suppose to die in the plane crash? If he had stayed in his original seat would he have died?
Ethan hanging him and it took Jack forever to revive him, any other times he came close to dying?

I understood it to be that present day island-Desmond "mentally" went into the past but only for the duration of time in-between the two blows to his head. Very confusing.

[Ms. Tumnus]

Looks like Desmond is named after a philosopher: David Hume

From EW

Basically, Hume's theory of compatibilism posits that free will and determinism both exist, and that what we do with our lives is essentially the result of these two concepts butting against each other. In other words, things are going all Sophie's World on us: Desmond Hume is living one of David Hume's theories.

[Pattijoretired]

jDH Ihav one question do you actualy live in a place called the devils backbone or did you just write that? I us live in an a they called the Devils Backbone in Texas.

Now back to Lost. That just confused me. I never thought he was trying to save Charlie.

[photochild]

Charlie's going to die?! Wow. Dominic must be pissed.


Very possibly, I heard on the radio this morning that he's been saying that he's also really frusterated with the way the show is going. When I heard that I figure that may be happening.

As for this episode...eh. I just wasn't that into it. Maybe later it'll all connect to make sense...the old woman and all that. I guess I just wasn't blown away by anything. And that whole, you're going to die no matter what reminded me too much of Final Destination.

[susanarosa]

I'm sick, so I fell asleep before Lost came on last night. I had all the intentions of getting up and watching it this morning, but htat didn't happen either.

But a friend e-mailed me about Charlie going to die. And I must say, that if it's true, I'm thrilled. :tongue:

[may1]

I thought it was good. I did not see it coming that Desmond had been trying to save Charlie, not Claire. (how similar their names are) I'll be glad to see Charlie go.
I did catch it about the song, but after the show ended.
Desmond's time travel, reminded me of a movie with Christopher Reeve called Somewhere in Time.

[J.D.H.]

jDH Ihav one question do you actualy live in a place called the devils backbone or did you just write that?
No, It's just the name of a movie I like.

[sawsee5]

Could it be that Charlie was suppose to die in the plane crash? If he had stayed in his original seat would he have died?
Ethan hanging him and it took Jack forever to revive him, any other times he came close to dying?

I understood it to be that present day island-Desmond "mentally" went into the past but only for the duration of time in-between the two blows to his head. Very confusing.

Great comments JDH! Poor Charlie! Do a google search on Hieronymus machines (Hieronymus is Charlie's last name).

Re: Dez Is Dez re-living all his life? Is he actually sitting in Jamaica, drinking rum, remembering his entire life?? I like your thought too, that it was 'only' a flashback. The antique dealer says (about buying the ring), "You have second thoughts". This implies that he already went through this time period and is re-living it a second time, but changing it to a degree. Notice how he threw the ring into the water, with the same frustration he had when Locke was giving his speech. It seemed that Dez had one of Michael's paintings in his 'flat'. The first photo option that the photographer gave Pen & Dez looked like the photo that was above the couch in the Hatch???

[J.D.H.]

hey Sawsee!
Something with this episode has me wondering if some part, the memories/flashbacks or the island experiences, is fabricated or constructed because too many little details like the paintings (the polar bear one in the office) and other stuff pop up in the flashbacks and it seems like it's planted. It's like it is more than the writers saying oh look an easter egg. This leaking or filtering of island symbols into flashbacks/memories has now become to pointed.

Was the picture in the hatch also in Hurley's shrink's office?

[Ms. Tumnus]

OK, I had forgotten how much work it can be to watch Lost. Things other people picked up that I totally missed:

Heroes crossovers: Was Desmond's professor friend is also Mohinder Suresh's friend on Heroes? In the last ep of Heroes, they showed a pamplet for Gannon Rent-a-Car, which is apparently a fictional company from Lost.

The painting in Widmore's office? The word NAMASTE was scribbled on it backwards, polar bear in it too???

[silentfire]

I LOVED this episode! Even though it didn't really give any solid answers and just gave us a big wtf, it still was great. I don't even know why but I swear this is the best episode of the new season. Was I the only one who thought that the old lady was a total ripoff of the Matrix's Oracle? I mean two old ladies who know the future of someone...

Desmond wtf you should have married penny, she was a babe in this episode. When it was revealed that he can't changed the future because "life finds a way" I instantly thought I had it figured out. Desmond was trying to save claire but each time he did something new happened. And then he reveals that it's not claire he is saving but charlie!! My head exploded, with WHOA.

Now that it's the morning after though, I still don't understand what happened lol. It seems now that they might try and pull out a Matrix suprise where this isnt a real world but a fake world and the people are being manipulated mentally.. I hope that is not the case...

[J.D.H.]

I almost mentioned Matrix too. All the easter eggs in the flashbacks are almost too much like the woman in the red dress.

[sawsee5]

hey Sawsee!
Something with this episode has me wondering if some part, the memories/flashbacks or the island experiences, is fabricated or constructed because too many little details like the paintings (the polar bear one in the office) and other stuff pop up in the flashbacks and it seems like it's planted. It's like it is more than the writers saying oh look an easter egg. This leaking or filtering of island symbols into flashbacks/memories has now become to pointed.

Was the picture in the hatch also in Hurley's shrink's office?

All the little details/props that are connected to everyone's flashbacks/flashforwards reinforce the idea that Room 23 is implanting these thoughts.
Is the Lady shopkeeper an Other?

[sawsee5]

When it was revealed that he can't changed the future because "life finds a way" I instantly thought I had it figured out. Desmond was trying to save claire but each time he did something new happened. And then he reveals that it's not claire he is saving but charlie!! My head exploded, with WHOA.

It seems now that they might try and pull out a Matrix suprise where this isnt a real world but a fake world and the people are being manipulated mentally.. I hope that is not the case...

The whole 'fake world' idea would be too easy for the writers, so I hope that isn't true. The Matrix owns this idea as they executed it, brilliantly.

[J.D.H.]

I was wondering that too Sawsee, in the previews there is a woman where Jack's in the cage and it looked strikingly similar to the pawnshop woman (only younger I think).
And is the pawn shop the same one Charlie visited in the episode where he was running a con and he was selling copying machines?
I saw that picture/painting too in desmond's flat and wondered if it was like the hatch mural.

[J.D.H.]

The whole 'fake world' idea would be too easy for the writers, so I hope that isn't true. The Matrix owns this idea as they executed it, brilliantly.

I wholeheartedly agree!

[Jinger]

This episode has my head spinning and I am still trying to figure out what is in my little pea brain.

I can't shake the feeling of a movie I saw but can't put my finger on what movie. All this stuff happens and at the end you discover that all these people in the movie and all the things that have happened have all been a product of one character's manifestations of all these people/places/things in his life.

So now after this episode and the weirdness of Desmond's "reliving" rather than "recalling" makes me wonder if there isn't one person on that island that has created all of these people based off of something in their life...it would so explain the placement of these easter eggs EVERYWHERE, it would explain all of the connections from one to the next, it would explain the "fantasy" element of things in that of course if it's in someone's mind, anything is possible. There are no boundaries regarding what makes sense in the real world and what is happening in someone's mind. And given the deja vu of Desmond's flashback, I might be inclined to say that he is the one creating this "world".

That being the case, everything that we have seen in flashbacks is what has happened to these people based on what Desmond belives them to be, because they are basically "characters" in Desmond's world. And Desmond really is on this island because he did try to sail in that race and he did get shipwrecked there. He is either dead, comatose, or just plain CRAZY and anything that has happened since Desmond hit that island is stuff that he has created in his current state....somewhere in all of these people's past they have had contact with him and that is how he pulls their images into his mind!?!? And all the other things are things that he remembers from his life before he hit the island...

I need to stop, my brain is going to explode! Does this make sense to anyone!?

[J.D.H.]

That's IDENTITY I think that you're thinking of.
I also think of DARK CITY when I watch Lost.

[Ms. Tumnus]

This episode has my head spinning and I am still trying to figure out what is in my little pea brain.

I can't shake the feeling of a movie I saw but can't put my finger on what movie. All this stuff happens and at the end you discover that all these people in the movie and all the things that have happened have all been a product of one character's manifestations of all these people/places/things in his life.


Are you talking about the movie iwth John Cussack? Identity, wasn't it?

What about blondie from last season? Hurley's girl (don't remember her name). Did Desmond ever meet her on the island? if not, why did he see her back in the "real" world?

[J.D.H.]

What about blondie from last season? Hurley's girl (don't remember her name). Did Desmond ever meet her on the island? if not, why did he see her back in the "real" world?

It seems that on the island there are a lot of near misses, I thought that too. If Libby had lived long enough to see Desmond and for Hurley to remember her in the Psych Ward. Lots of ships passing in the night.

[PaulieWalnutz]

The whole 'fake world' idea would be too easy for the writers, so I hope that isn't true. The Matrix owns this idea as they executed it, brilliantly.


I wholeheartedly agree. That we be so bogus. I don't think they are going to go that route, but maybe I give the writers/producers too much credit.

[may1]

Ms Tumnus, that was Libby. She gave the boat to Desmond.

[PaulieWalnutz]

It seems that on the island there are a lot of near misses, I thought that too. If Libby had lived long enough to see Desmond and for Hurley to remember her in the Psych Ward. Lots of ships passing in the night.


If I am not mistaken there has only been one time where people on the island recongized that they had met in the past and that was when sawyer realized he knew Jacks dad... Other than that they have been keeping the other run in's not so memerable (i.e. Sayid's girl and Locke)

[J.D.H.]

If I am not mistaken there has only been one time where people on the island recongized that they had met in the past and that was when sawyer realized he knew Jacks dad... Other than that they have been keeping the other run in's not so memerable (i.e. Sayid's girl and Locke)

And Boone and Sawyer, and Sayid and Shanon in the airport, or Jack and Shanon. And I can't stand the way only a few (two or three) will learn some information or have some wierd experience on the island and never share it with the group.

[PaulieWalnutz]

And Boone and Sawyer, and Sayid and Shanon in the airport, or Jack and Shanon. And I can't stand the way only a few (two or three) will learn some information or have some wierd experience on the island and never share it with the group.

You would think that they would be sharing all the information they come accross wouldn't you? It's not like there is alot of hostility between people and they generally seem to trust eachother. The only thing I can think of is that they really don't all hang out that much becuase they always seem to be doing different things.

On a complete side note, it is nice that they have stopped writing in the new lost characters that everyone hated. They were aweful.

[sawsee5]

It seems that on the island there are a lot of near misses, I thought that too. If Libby had lived long enough to see Desmond and for Hurley to remember her in the Psych Ward. Lots of ships passing in the night.

It seems very odd that Charlie would not have remembered Dez! Especially after Dez's rant and rain prediction! It makes me think that, either:

- that scene has not happened yet, so Charlie has not experienced it

- or, Dez is dreaming it when he is knocked out in the hatch and 'changing' it with the knowledge he know has. :unsure:

Does that make any sense?

JDH: I like your byline!

[wesb]

When the woman in the pawnshop began lecturing Desmond on what he was or was not supposed to do, the story became very surreal. It's hard to imagine that he was remembering an event like that that had happened earlier in his life. Is this an imagined event? Something Desmond tried to change in his memories but couldn't? Are there others besides Desmond who "remember" the future, and this was an instance of them communicating?

And in at least some cases, Desmond _can_ change how things will turn out. He was able to prevent the bartender from getting clobbered with the cricket bat, though he took the hit himself.

[Lady-in-Gray]

I did get a momentary feeling last night that everything about Lost is in somebody's (Desmond's?) head and that nothing about the show is "real". That thought really angered me, so I dismissed it.....

[loula]

I freaking loved this ep. Best one in a long time.

I got a very "Dark City" kind of vibe, like someone has access to Desmond's memories and can manipulate them. We already know the Giant Smoke Monster Fist thing can access people's memories - maybe it can change them too. I'm thinking this whole island scenario has been "reset" a number of times, so that he's not remembering the future, he's just got some residual memories of how it all went down last time. It could also be he's Unstuck in Time, but I like the idea that maybe everyone's memories are being manipulated, and Desmond's just the first one to realize it. Maybe his longer proximity to the big electromagnet triggered some kind of side effect where memories that are supposed to have been blocked out are bleeding through. Maybe some version of this is what happened to Walt.

But if everyone's memories are false, it could be a huge experiment like Dark City, where they go through this island obstacle course over and over again, only sometimes Kate is the doctor and Jack's the fugitive, etc., and the idea is to see how people's past shapes how they act, which I think is kind of a main theme of the show in the first place. It would be a nice way to explain why everyone's in each other's flashbacks, along with the numbers.

Regardless, I love how this explain's Desmond's weird behavior pretty much across the board, all the way back to his encounter with Jack in the gym. See you in another life, brotha. Cool.

More this, more continuity, less love triangle. I really don't want to hate the Others plotline but they're making it hard for me to not resent the hell out of it for taking up so much screentime. Let's give everyone their fair share, eh?

[Jinger]

That's IDENTITY I think that you're thinking of.
I also think of DARK CITY when I watch Lost.

No, I thought Identity too but yes, same kind of premise. The movie I'm thinking of was one of those straight to dvd/cable I watched one boring afternoon.

What about blondie from last season? Hurley's girl (don't remember her name). Did Desmond ever meet her on the island? if not, why did he see her back in the "real" world?

She was on the island because he saw her in the "real" world.

And Boone and Sawyer, and Sayid and Shanon in the airport, or Jack and Shanon. And I can't stand the way only a few (two or three) will learn some information or have some wierd experience on the island and never share it with the group.

I don't think any of the "meetings" at the airport really count as crossovers because it's only natural that if you are on a flight you are going to cross paths with some of the people on your flight at the airport.

It seems very odd that Charlie would not have remembered Dez! Especially after Dez's rant and rain prediction! It makes me think that, either:

- that scene has not happened yet, so Charlie has not experienced it

- or, Dez is dreaming it when he is knocked out in the hatch and 'changing' it with the knowledge he know has. :unsure:

Does that make any sense?

Charlie didn't remember him because it didn't happen that way the first time which is what Charlie's memory is. All Charlie would remember was that he was playing guitar on a corner, and the first time Des would have breezed right past b/c he didn't know him then.

[J.D.H.]

Loula
I love your avatar image - that looks like a Mark Ryden painting.

Hi Lady and Wes, it is good to see you both.

When Desmond starts reading the book (that he's saving to read before he dies) it's time to worry.

[Jinger]

Regardless, I love how this explain's Desmond's weird behavior pretty much across the board, all the way back to his encounter with Jack in the gym. See you in another life, brotha. Cool.

Whoa...i just had a thought when I read this. What if, when Des was at the stadium thing he went there specifically to see Jack because that was Des having already been on the island and having a flashback/relive moment?!?!? And he said "see ya in another life brotha" because he already knew that Jack was gonna be on the island!?

all right, seriously, this episode is making my freakin brain hurt!

[loula]

I love your avatar image - that looks like a Mark Ryden painting.

It totally is! And you're my new best pal for knowing that.

I completely missed your previous Dark City shoutout while I was composing my elaborate theory. But that whole idea has been part of my Unified Theory Of LOST for some time.

If we're right, I'll share my Stephen Colbert "I CALLED IT!" signs with you.

And Jinger: Absolutely. I'm thinking he's preparing for this boat race, which he knows he's fated to go on. He sees Jack in the stadium and goes, oh right, that doctor guy who saved that girl! (He remembers him from his "first pass" on the island, the same way he remembered Charlie - I think Jack told his whole "saved a girl and married her" story to Des in the Hatch, anybody remember?) So Des chooses to encourage him, because he knows how the story ends. Which perhaps gave Jack the confidence he needed to save her. Dude. That high-pitched whine you hear is the sound of my brain hurting. But it hurts so good! Please sir may I have another!

[silentfire]

Didn't the producers/writers say that in the end everything can be explained scientifically and it won't be something sci-fi crazy?

[J.D.H.]

Didn't the producers/writers say that in the end everything can be explained scientifically and it won't be something sci-fi crazy?

I don't know, but good luck to them if they did. How do you explain the Black Mist Monster?

[JulieM]

Has to be one of the best ones yet! Too cool for words.

[sawsee5]

It totally is! And you're my new best pal for knowing that.


And Jinger: Absolutely. I'm thinking he's preparing for this boat race, which he knows he's fated to go on. He sees Jack in the stadium and goes, oh right, that doctor guy who saved that girl! (He remembers him from his "first pass" on the island, the same way he remembered Charlie - I think Jack told his whole "saved a girl and married her" story to Des in the Hatch, anybody remember?) So Des chooses to encourage him, because he knows how the story ends. Which perhaps gave Jack the confidence he needed to save her. Dude. That high-pitched whine you hear is the sound of my brain hurting. But it hurts so good! Please sir may I have another!


Interesting that Jack would remember him and not Charlie. I think JDH posted (or wesb) that Dez's flashback of Charlie was Dez's new interpretation and interaction as he probably did not interact with Charlie the first time.

[Jinger]

Charlie didn't remember him because it didn't happen that way the first time which is what Charlie's memory is. All Charlie would remember was that he was playing guitar on a corner, and the first time Des would have breezed right past b/c he didn't know him then.

Interesting that Jack would remember him and not Charlie. I think JDH posted (or wesb) that Dez's flashback of Charlie was Dez's new interpretation and interaction as he probably did not interact with Charlie the first time.


It was me!

Jack remembered him because (if the theory holds water) Des went to see Jack in a timeline that happened before the crash, i.e. Des was still alone on the island and put himself "in" Jack's timeline. Whereas with Charlie he went back to one that existed already and it was after the crash. Crap, there's that sharp pain in my head again...must....rest....brain.....

[J.D.H.]

Didn't Mr Widmore tell Dez about the scotch bottle originator, and something about sailing off to an island (am I remembering this correctly)? Could this have been the BlackRock's owner?

[chooch850]

I enjoyed this episode thoroughly, but you guys give me a headache with all your theories. It's a TV show.... enjoy it for that alone and you'll be alot happier.

[Jinger]

This is what people that love the show do...analyze and theorize and get excited about new ideas. I'm happy, this is fun!

[LonnaSaur]

Well, consider me officially re-interested in Lost! I was starting to get annoyed with it, but this episode was awesome. It didn't hurt that it was focused on Desmond, who is a wonderful characater who is not bad-looking either. I loved it!

[chooch850]

This is what people that love the show do...analyze and theorize and get excited about new ideas. I'm happy, this is fun!

I know you love the show Jinger.. It is obvious in your posts...... but I don't like it when people get really pissed about what the writers are trying to do..... in the end, they are just trying to entertain while making some money for ABC... and that's a fact Brother.:D

[Pekmboyd]

I know you love the show Jinger.. It is obvious in your posts...... but I don't like it when people get really pissed about what the writers are trying to do..... in the end, they are just trying to entertain while making some money for ABC... and that's a fact Brother.:D

AMEN! I enjoy this show SO much more when I don't think about it....I don't always succeed, but it's worth a shot.

[loula]

Interesting that Jack would remember him and not Charlie. I think JDH posted (or wesb) that Dez's flashback of Charlie was Dez's new interpretation and interaction as he probably did not interact with Charlie the first time.

That's a good point. I thought it had more to do with the fact that Jack met Desmond on possibly the most memorable, significant day in his life. He's all tortured cause he promised to fix a girl he can't fix, then he gets a pep talk from some random jogging Scotsman, who tells him he'll see him in another life, and Jack goes on to perform the miracle that will change the course of his entire life.

Charlie, on the other hand, presumably ran in to any number of raging nutters playing street music in "London." He probably had a version of that conversation a few times a day.

Re: scientific explanations, I just keep thinking that pretty much all science would have looked like magic to anyone who didn't grow up with it. At this moment I'm typing words in to a magic box that can talk to the whole world! But that's one of the reasons I like the idea of implanted memories, is because one could at least argue that it's possible. Juliet gets people pregnant with needles, someone else manipulates people's memory. I'm okay with science fiction as long as it's heavy on the "science" and light on the "contrived bullshit."

[Jinger]

I know you love the show Jinger.. It is obvious in your posts...... but I don't like it when people get really pissed about what the writers are trying to do..... in the end, they are just trying to entertain while making some money for ABC... and that's a fact Brother.:D


AMEN! I enjoy this show SO much more when I don't think about it....I don't always succeed, but it's worth a shot.

Now the world don't move
To the beat of just one drum
What might be right for you
May not be right for some....

Oh guys, I'm just enjoying it "differently" than you is all. I am not pissed at the writers, I am thoroughly entertained and I like to think about it and all the twists and turns. Here's the thing...I have no life of my own, I need my shows to feel complete and Lost completes me!

[LonnaSaur]

Does anyone remember when "The Sixth Sense" came out and M. Night Shaymalan (sp?) said the color red was a clue to what was happening in the story? There were some heavy-handed uses of the color red in this episode and it reminded me of the movie in that way. There was the red paint, the red sneakers, and the red whiskey label that stood out the most. I wonder if it is significant, or just a red herring (no pun intended).

Also, is anyone else confused yet intrigued by the white-haired woman's words? She said that Desmond had to go push the button or everyone would die, yet later she told him that no one could keep the red sneakered guy from dying because it was supposed to happen. If everyone is going to die, and the universe "course corrects" then why does Desmond have to do anything? We all going to die anyway. This really confused me and I wondered if she was manipulating him.

[may1]

What to do?

http://www.imdb.com/news/wenn/2007-02-15/celeb/4

[t-bag]

Can't read fast enough to keep up with these threads....

[J.D.H.]

Let's discuss GreyBishop's recent recap.

Interesting about the McCutcheon being a chess move, definitely feels like their being played and toyed with, moved around by the hands of fate.

[LOSTbean]

brilliant-absolutely brilliant, with a large side dish of wit served. good job GB! i need ot read it again and get in the discussion mode, but i want to shell out the cyber kudos ASAP! dude, you rock. :thumbup:

[J.D.H.]

I bet Donovan and Penny teamed up to begin a search for Desmond, hence the antarctic-based Portuguese speaking two man team and their constant monitoring for EM anomalies (thanks to Donovan's brilliance and Penny's money).

[TinkerbellAPixie]

As clever as your title was - would you be terribly offended if I merged this with the thread already started on this topic? Rather than having two running dialogues on the same episode.

[ScotyUtah]

As clever as your title was - would you be terribly offended if I merged this with the thread already started on this topic? Rather than having two running dialogues on the same episode.

Now that's what I call moderating. :winkiss:

[pearlblackdragon]

Also, is anyone else confused yet intrigued by the white-haired woman's words? She said that Desmond had to go push the button or everyone would die, yet later she told him that no one could keep the red sneakered guy from dying because it was supposed to happen. If everyone is going to die, and the universe "course corrects" then why does Desmond have to do anything? We all going to die anyway. This really confused me and I wondered if she was manipulating him.

(For the sake of my argument the lady is going to be TO - The Originals)
I took it that TO meant "we" as in whomever is in charge of all of this. If Desmond didn't go to the Island, didn't get stuck in the hatch, didn't forget to push the button causing the EMP that causes the plane to crash, then the whole experiment would have been for nought. AND maybe, just maybe, TO is one of the kids that were concieved on the Island. With the time travel aspect TO's all have jobs to go back in time and ensure that the events that created the TO's happen - hence her statement "If you don't go to that Island and push that button, we all die" Like Back To The Future - If my mom and dad didn't meet, get married etc. I would be dead.

[Chris]

With the time travel aspect TO's all have jobs to go back in time and ensure that the events that created the TO's happen - hence her statement "If you don't go to that Island and push that button, we all die" Like Back To The Future - If my mom and dad didn't meet, get married etc. I would be dead.

Maybe also like the psychic that sent Claire to the island?

[J.D.H.]

Maybe also like the psychic that sent Claire to the island?

And the healer that Rose met with.

[J.D.H.]

As clever as your title was - would you be terribly offended if I merged this with the thread already started on this topic? Rather than having two running dialogues on the same episode.

I was hoping people would discuss some the points and research that GB did for his recap here.

[TinkerbellAPixie]

I was hoping people would discuss some the points and research that GB did for his recap here.

Ok, just thought I'd ask

[TinkerbellAPixie]

Actually - wait, are we going to have two threads for each episode? One for the show and one for the recap? Because the comments section of the recap is for recap discussion and we also discuss the recaps in our show discussions on the forums. But having two threads - each week - can really clutter the boards and make it more difficult for newbies to navigate.

I'm not trying to be a creep or anything. But - for every other program we do one new thread per each new episode and that formula seems to work.

[Jinger]

I agree with Tink, 2 threads for one episode doesn't work well. The recap is basically...the show so it all falls into the same scope of conversation.

I'm not trying to be a creep either :unsure2: I didn't like it last week and just throwing my 2 cents in cuz that's just how I roll...:p

[J.D.H.]

Totally understand your point.
I'm just trying to call attention to the recap. I really feel his recaps are well written and witty and thought provoking. And didn't want it overlooked in the general episode discussion.
Do what you must, I understand your position. But "What the..." does not an episode-centric discussion make.

[Jinger]

Hey, the lightbulb just went off...you can post regarding recaps in the comment section after the recap...!?!? yes?!

[TinkerbellAPixie]

Totally understand your point.
I'm just trying to call attention to the recap. I really feel his recaps are well written and witty and thought provoking. And didn't want it overlooked in the general episode discussion.
Do what you must, I understand your position. But "What the..." does not an episode-centric discussion make.

How about we make a compromise? I can merge threads and merge titles.

I realize you want to recognize your buddy for his great recap. We get that- we are fans of our writers too. That's why we are here in the first place. So if I merge your title - and the threads and we all go to the combined thread and praise your pal (said teasingly not meanly) - will that work? :blushing:

[J.D.H.]

TinkerbellaPixie,
That works, and very diplomatic. Thank you.
Can we put a link to the recap in the first post of said episode thread?

And thanks for making me feel like a part of the process, that was very cool. I know that you could've just merged the two threads with no explanation. I appreciate what you did!

[TinkerbellAPixie]

Well - we all go off topic - all the time. I think the main think is that we veer back on topic more often than we veer off. And I know I am probably one of the most guilty of taking things off topic because I like the conversational tone of forums where you can kinda meander a little bit.

Since I have JDH's blessing - I'm gonna go ahead and merge them. Hope that's ok with you Grey.

[pearlblackdragon]

I don't want to put words in J.D.H.'s mouth, but when it was mentioned that some people didn't like last week, it occurs to me that J.D.H. might have given you your solution.

If you didn't like the fact that the discussion ran off in all directions last week, perhaps a more "open discussion" thread might serve to allow that meandering conversation to not "clutter up" the base thread for that week's episode.

You could even have a "main" and "open" thread running at the same time, which if named well would give both newbies and regs the heads up as to where they want to stick their two cents. I'm pretty sure that two threads that were labelled that way wouldn't confuse anyone.

As for the "discuss the recaps in the recap comments section", that's fine in theory, but it's slow and lacking any possibility of adding smilies, html, avatars or signatures that make up part of the projected personalities on a forum like this one. Since all these new folks went to the trouble of signing up and reading the rules, it seems kinda mean to relegate them to the less spiffy comments section, don't you think?

I'm just a guest with an opinion though, so it's not my call.:)


I don't think people meant to offend anyone. I think the whole problem with the veering off topic was that it wasn't going back on topic. If you want to chat or throw kudo's to your buddies their are a million different threads for that. Hell we even have a thread where we just post pictures of hot men. If you think people got weird when you go off topic on the Lost board you should see what happens when you change the subject on half naked men. NOT PRETTY.

As for the recap discussions on the comments section...well we all read the recaps and we tend to give our "big ups" and minor discussions in the comments section. Then we come for a more in depth discussion on the board. We all ALSO had to go through the signup process, and so far no-one seems worse for the wear.

One thread per episode seems more than fair. BUT maybe we could have ONE thread meant for general discussion....not a new Lost General Discussion thread every week...just one that goes on and on and on.

Check yes or no and pass back......

[TinkerbellAPixie]

Ok - the merge is complete. Now - commence talking about Lost and how great a writer GreyBishop is and how sexy Sayid is and how moderatalicious I am :)

[JulieM]

I bow to your esteemed moderataliciousness

[Crazy4Lost]

I'm not trying to be a kink in the hose pipe here, but I can't help but notice there were 2 threads running last week (and continue to be there) for last week's ep "Lost In Portland". Why is there an issue with it this week or why didn't the 2 last week get combined?

Just curious....

[TinkerbellAPixie]

I'm not trying to be a kink in the hose pipe here, but I can't help but notice there were 2 threads running last week (and continue to be there) for last week's ep "Lost In Portland". Why is there an issue with it this week or why didn't the 2 last week get combined?

Just curious....

Because we were trying to be kind and welcoming to our new friends. We didn't realize it was going to be the start of a confusing trend. We aren't trying to mean or upset anyone. Just trying to be organized :o

[Pekmboyd]

See...since this site is about ALL TV, we try to keep the number of threads about each show to a minimum for organization sake. That way if you like 2 or 3 shows you don't have to track 15 threads. (And most of us like way more than 2 or 3)

On a Lost Only site, I could understand having individual threads for every possible area of discussion, but we spread the love around here.

[Tabby Lavalamp]

What the hell happened to the title of this thread? I just put "What the....?", and no puns about "You Can't Go Hume..."
If someone doesn't like the title of my thread, start another one, but please don't go putting words in my mouth.

[TinkerbellAPixie]

What the hell happened to the title of this thread? I just put "What the....?", and no puns about "You Can't Go Hume..."
If someone doesn't like the title of my thread, start another one, but please don't go putting words in my mouth.

Read back a few pages Tabby - no one was putting words in your mouth - we were trying to consolidate and compromise and be inclusive.

The threads (and their titles) were merged.

[jampony]

What the hell happened to the title of this thread? I just put "What the....?", and no puns about "You Can't Go Hume..."
If someone doesn't like the title of my thread, start another one, but please don't go putting words in my mouth.

Don't take it personally, tabby. I think someone was just trying to make it clear what the thread was about. When I start a new thread, I know some people get annoyed with me because I put the name of the show, the title of the episode and the date it aired, but I do that because it's easier to see what the thread is about, especially for people with rss readers or people who use their Control Panel to view new posts.

[Jinger]

See...since this site is about ALL TV, we try to keep the number of threads about each show to a minimum for organization sake. That way if you like 2 or 3 shows you don't have to track 15 threads. (And most of us like way more than 2 or 3)

On a Lost Only site, I could understand having individual threads for every possible area of discussion, but we spread the love around here.

....said way more eloquently than what I was trying to say.

Sorry if I sounded unwelcoming of new ideas...some people embrace change, I fear it:wacko: I will up my meds....

[Tabby Lavalamp]

Read back a few pages Tabby - no one was putting words in your mouth - we were trying to consolidate and compromise and be inclusive.

The threads (and their titles) were merged.
After I posted, I read back and saw that. I appreciate that one of the two thread originators were asked.

[jampony]

Read back a few pages Tabby

You're cute, tink. Like anyone can keep up with the 80+ posts that literally popped up overnight! :)

I read the first 15, skimmed the next 10 or so and gave up after that. I'll catch up on the weekend. I can't wait to read everyone's thoughts! (Oooh... I sound like I think I'm Matt Parker!)

[TinkerbellAPixie]

After I posted, I read back and saw that. I appreciate that one of the two thread originators were asked.

I didn't ask you because to be honest, I truly did not think you would mind. I thought you would understand why it was being merged. I apologize if I upset anyone.

If it helps I merged that thread into YOUR thread.

[jampony]

If it helps I merged that thread into YOUR thread.
Oh my god! It's still all about tabby!

;)

[Tabby Lavalamp]

Oh my god! It's still all about Tabby!

;)
Well, of course.

[TinkerbellAPixie]

So, in attempt to get back on topic.

Tabby, what did you think of naked Desmond running through the forest? Too much foliage?

[Tabby Lavalamp]

So, in attempt to get back on topic.

Tabby, what did you think of naked Desmond running through the forest? Too much foliage?
I like him better clothed.

It was a good episode, but they just started up a whole hell of a lot of new questions while not answering any old ones. The best part of it was the hope that Charlie will soon be gone.

[t-bag]

Yeah, but THREE QUESTIONS WILL BE ANSWERED NEXT WEEK.

Bullshit.

[jampony]

I liked Desmond completely naked, but when he was walking away from the camera carrying Claire he had some pretty heavy duty muffin tops going on. But he sure is tan, isn't he? Yum.

[photochild]

Insanity.

[Pekmboyd]

Yeah, but THREE QUESTIONS WILL BE ANSWERED NEXT WEEK.

Bullshit.

Oh no T-bag, I totally believe them. The problem is the three questions will be like this:

What is Claire's baby's middle name?
How old is Bernard?
What kind of car did Jack drive in 1984?

[t-bag]

Oh no T-bag, I totally believe them. The problem is the three questions will be like this:

What is Claire's baby's middle name?
How old is Bernard?
What kind of car did Jack drive in 1984?

Ha! Excellent point. And then even those will be contested by something revealed in the final three minutes.

[Jinger]

So after all that back and forth yesterday about merging the threads...now everyone is done talking about Lost! :confused1:

Poor Tink, put through the ringer for no good reason!

[chooch850]

I agree Jinger..... all that bullshit about 2 threads to discuss our favorite show and Tink tried to make everyone happy and now it seems that everyone's in a snit and POUTING!!!! So no ones gonna talk about LOST. Didn't know we were dealing with children.

On topic now..... I have always loved time travel-themed stories ever since I saw "The Time Machine" as a kid. I don't think the others Losties flashbacks have been TTing but that would explain some of Hurley's FB's ... I'll take your advice Jinger and think about this abit more LOL

[pearlblackdragon]

(For the sake of my argument the lady is going to be TO - The Originals)
I took it that TO meant "we" as in whomever is in charge of all of this. If Desmond didn't go to the Island, didn't get stuck in the hatch, didn't forget to push the button causing the EMP that causes the plane to crash, then the whole experiment would have been for nought. AND maybe, just maybe, TO is one of the kids that were concieved on the Island. With the time travel aspect TO's all have jobs to go back in time and ensure that the events that created the TO's happen - hence her statement "If you don't go to that Island and push that button, we all die" Like Back To The Future - If my mom and dad didn't meet, get married etc. I would be dead.

My post got lost in all of the kerfuffle...but I would like to know what other people think of my theory...I need to know what idea's you all might have that conflict/concur with my theory, because right now this is how I am viewing the show.....

[Jinger]

Based on my memories of past flashbacks, I'd hazard a guess and say that Desmond really is the first one to go back in time. Unless I have missed it being brought up, I think it's extremely interesting that he was sent back in time when he turned that key, and interesting that when he "returned" he was nekked. I am curious what set him apart from everyone else that was in close proximity to the electromagnetic field when the system failure occured. I know he turned the key and all but the failsafe where he was wasn't all that far away from Locke, Charlie and/or Locke.

OH, just had a thought pop in my head! Remember when Charlie came back after the "sky turned purple" and really was not himself at all, just totally acting weird!? I wonder, do you think that the other 3 that were in the hatch at the time are going to be having some kind of backstory that will either be same, similiar to Des w/the time travel or if they were affected in a completely different way that will blow our minds like Des's experience did!?

damn! I'm doing it to my brain again...must take a break! :blink:

[Jinger]

My post got lost in all of the kerfuffle...but I would like to know what other people think of my theory...I need to know what idea's you all might have that conflict/concur with my theory, because right now this is how I am viewing the show.....

I kind of see where your head is with this, but Desmond has only been there for 3 years so by that time TO's have been conceived and living on the island for years and years so I am either unable to wrap my brain around your theory or timewise that won't work. They would/should have had someone working those buttons since they built that...which I guess brings up something else. Was that electromagnet thing built or a natural occurance and if it was build why would anyone build something that can destroy them? What purpose does it serve? Because if the purpose was to hide the island, they should be found soon!?!

OH, PBD....you got my head spinnin!

[Lady-in-Gray]

Chooch:

When we Greybishop Groupies arrived here last week, we were warmly welcomed by some of you. That made us feel good about joining your group and fitting in. We're a pretty gregarious group and we like being where we fit in and can enjoy everyone's (and I do mean everyone's) company.

In pretty short order, that Welcome Mat was yanked out from under some of us by the Topic/Rules Police. At that point, being here started to make some of us feel uncomfortable. Yesterday's debate made all of us feel really uncomfortable.

I can't speak for all of the Groupies, but, in my 63 years, I have learned that when a situation becomes uncomfortable, it's time to leave. I consider walking away to be a mature decision, not a childish one.

TVgasm is your sandbox and you are entitled to have whatever rules you choose to have. By the same token, I am entitled to play where ever I choose to play. No hard feelings here. That's just the way it is.

Best of luck to all of you, even Mr. t-bag.

[TinkerbellAPixie]

In pretty short order, that Welcome Mat was yanked out from under some of us by the Topic/Rules Police. At that point, being here started to make some of us feel uncomfortable. Yesterday's debate made all of us feel really uncomfortable.

I am very sorry you feel that way. I gather I am the "Topic/Rules Police" you refer to. I didn't think I was pulling any mat out from under anyone. I didn't delete anyone's posts or threads without discussing it first to be sure it was ok and people were on board with the merged thread. At the time that I did the merge - I was under the impression that things were cool with J.D.H. and I. The last thing I wanted to do was make anyone feel unwelcome.

We enjoyed all the insight you guys brought to a show that we all enjoy. I don't really understand the reaction to something that was just done to make things a little more orderly in a site with a lot of posts.

I do hope you rethink your decision and realize we really are a nice bunch of people. We have many opinions and that's what makes it such an interesting place to hang out.

[jampony]

What about blondie from last season? Hurley's girl (don't remember her name). Did Desmond ever meet her on the island? if not, why did he see her back in the "real" world?
When did they meet in the real world?

So now after this episode and the weirdness of Desmond's "reliving" rather than "recalling" ... And given the deja vu of Desmond's flashback, I might be inclined to say that he is the one creating this "world".
I kind of thought he was just unconscious and dreaming and merging facts (people he already knows from the real world and the island) with fiction (how he wishes things had gone in the real world). I'm really looking forward to seeing how this plays out. Now that the producers have announced they're going to end the show themselves (maybe in a couple of years), I'm almost looking forward to that just so I can see everything wrapped up.

I agree Jinger..... all that bullshit about 2 threads to discuss our favorite show and Tink tried to make everyone happy and now it seems that everyone's in a snit and POUTING!!!! So no ones gonna talk about LOST. Didn't know we were dealing with children.
Maybe people weren't pouting. Maybe they were just at work and couldn't post anything until they got home. And then maybe these last posts pissed them off and that's why they're not posting now.



Seriously, GB Groupies, most of us are good people and we really did enjoy hearing all your theories. It seems like, for a while now, our posts have been like "that was great", "yeah, I liked it", "I can't wait for next week", "Desmond's hot". You all brought an energy I, for one, haven't seen in a while.

[zoobabe]

I loved this episode b/c it was all about Desmond. even if it was a bit confuding I'm starting to understand it more now without really understanding anything better. It broke my heart to see Des come back "to" on the island and beg for another chance to make it right with Penny. I want there to be a way to save Charlie though b/c I like him on the show even if he is insanely jealous of any man around Claire. hopefully next week will answer more wuestions about the Others and what the hell they're doing.

[Pekmboyd]

OK Gang - I'm gonna play diplomat. I hereby appoint myself Secretary of TvGasm State ( I look nothing like Condi, btw)

Things went bad, people got their feelings hurt, people were mean, people apologized.

I'm requesting that from here on out, it stays dropped. What's past is past, and dragging it up and hashing it out isn't going to make it better. Let's all make a collective decision to let it drop and go back to our formerly happy ways. And if any of our recent departees decides to return, I hope it is in the spirit of reconciliation, as I expect my fellow Gasmii to do.

Sincerely,
Secretary Pekmboyd

[pearlblackdragon]

OK Gang - I'm gonna play diplomat. I hereby appoint myself Secretary of TvGasm State ( I look nothing like Condi, btw)

Things went bad, people got their feelings hurt, people were mean, people apologized.

I'm requesting that from here on out, it stays dropped. What's past is past, and dragging it up and hashing it out isn't going to make it better. Let's all make a collective decision to let it drop and go back to our formerly happy ways. And if any of our recent departees decides to return, I hope it is in the spirit of reconciliation, as I expect my fellow Gasmii to do.

Sincerely,
Secretary Pekmboyd

You take this "mom" thing seriously don't you.....;)

[J.D.H.]

Hi. So Desmond wakes up naked in the jungle. And now it looks like he may have traveled back in time, if only mentally and not physically. So, what was up with the nakedness? I know in the Terminator movies that all the men who came from the future were naked when they appeared in the present. And the pop culture referrences are all over the place on this show. So do you think the nakedness lends to Desmond travelling through time?
Honsetly, I'm confused and don't know what to think.

[TinkerbellAPixie]

Hi. So Desmond wakes up naked in the jungle. And now it looks like he may have traveled back in time, if only mentally and not physically. So, what was up with the nakedness? I know in the Terminator movies that all the men who came from the future were naked when they appeared in the present. And the pop culture referrences are all over the place on this show. So do you think the nakedness lends to Desmond travelling through time?
Honsetly, I'm confused and don't know what to think.

Hello J.D.H. :)

I think it could be the whole "re-birth", we come into this world naked. The image of that blown up hatch could represent a birth canal and Desmond the naked reborn is left at the opening. He is re-born on the island and has new powers and bright new eyes that see things more clearly than he did before.

I could be completely off the mark though.

[jampony]

Hi. So Desmond wakes up naked in the jungle. And now it looks like he may have traveled back in time, if only mentally and not physically. So, what was up with the nakedness? I know in the Terminator movies that all the men who came from the future were naked when they appeared in the present. And the pop culture referrences are all over the place on this show. So do you think the nakedness lends to Desmond travelling through time?
Honsetly, I'm confused and don't know what to think.

I like to think the nakedness was just a little gift to all the women who watch Lost. :swoon:

Just kidding. I'm still not feeling the time travel theory (still going with unconscious and dreaming) but it would be cool if that's what it was.

Could the explosion have "knocked off" his clothes? No, I guess not; you'd think there would be some shreds left on him. Maybe the Others found him and did some crap to him (like room 23 stuff?) and then left him in the jungle.

Who knows. Who cares? I'm just really enjoying the crazy ride!

[chooch850]

The Terminator reference is a good one. Inanimate objects can't transport thru time or something like that. What I wanna know is he still flashing the past and is ahead of everyone by days or weeks ??? and when he turned that key, did the magnetic force cease to exist totally or just for a moment and now it is permanently in place. Does that make any sense at all???

[TinkerbellAPixie]

Could the explosion have "knocked off" his clothes? No, I guess not; you'd think there would be some shreds left on him.

Actually - when it first happened I did think he was just blown out of his clothes, that happens in tornadoes and hurricanes and other types of things. I'm just amazed he wasn't more scratched up. Especially after seeing that hatch hole.

[J.D.H.]

Hello J.D.H. :)

I think it coulod be the whole "re-birth", we come into this world naked. The image of that blown up hatch could represent a birth canal and Desmond the naked reborn is left at the opening. He is re-born on the island and has new powers and bright new eyes that see things more clearly than he did before.

I could be completely off the mark though.

Hi Tink.
That's a really interesting and heavy on the symbolism! Cool.
I have question about that episode - charlie was deafened, Locke couldn't speak, and it looked like Eko (who I really miss on the show, greatest backstory of any character) seemd to have been blinded, if only slightly. What is the meaning of those monkeys that have their mouths, eyes an ears covered? Because that's what I thought of immediately. Anyone else?

[jampony]

Hi Tink.
That's a really interesting and heavy on the symbolism! Cool.
I have question about that episode - charlie was deafened, Locke couldn't speak, and it looked like Eko (who I really miss on the show, greatest backstory of any character) seemd to have been blinded, if only slightly. What is the meaning of those monkeys that have their mouths, eyes an ears covered? Because that's what I thought of immediately. Anyone else?

I totally missed that and I have that statue on my desk staring me in the face every day! :)

[TinkerbellAPixie]

I have question about that episode - charlie was deafened, Locke couldn't speak, and it looked like Eko (who I really miss on the show, greatest backstory of any character) seemd to have been blinded, if only slightly. What is the meaning of those monkeys that have their mouths, eyes an ears covered? Because that's what I thought of immediately. Anyone else?

I totally missed that and I have that statue on my desk staring me in the face every day! :)

OOOH I missed that too! But great point. I still find Charlie's behavior when he returned to be the weirdest and very in appropriate in light of what happened.

As for Eko- I will miss that man, his character was riveting and he acted the part so brilliantly. It makes me sad to know he didn't like being on the show.

[Ms. Tumnus]

When did they meet in the real world?


She gave Desmond her boat to race around the world. They met in a coffee shop. It was one of the last, if not the last, episode of the year.

[jampony]

She gave Desmond her boat to race around the world. They met in a coffee shop. It was one of the last, if not the last, episode of the year.

Oh, I remember now. Thanks!

[pearlblackdragon]

Hey J.D.H, since you made the Terminator reference....wasn't the time travel device an electromagnetic something or other on that movie?? If so maybe that big electromagnet wasn't a giant bomb....maybe it opens the time portal and has to be reset every 108 minutes to keep the portal closed....when desmond put in the key he was already going through time, but he stopped everyone else on the island from going through....just a thought

[TinkerbellAPixie]

Hey J.D.H, since you made the Terminator reference....wasn't the time travel device an electromagnetic something or other on that movie?? If so maybe that big electromagnet wasn't a giant bomb....maybe it opens the time portal and has to be reset every 108 minutes to keep the portal closed....when desmond put in the key he was already going through time, but he stopped everyone else on the island from going through....just a thought

OOOH like Stargate!

[sawsee5]

Hello J.D.H. :)

I think it could be the whole "re-birth", we come into this world naked. The image of that blown up hatch could represent a birth canal and Desmond the naked reborn is left at the opening. He is re-born on the island and has new powers and bright new eyes that see things more clearly than he did before.

I could be completely off the mark though.

Hi All! The nakedness seems quite symbolic so labelling it as a 're-birth' makes a lot of sense. Or was ABC just trying to increase viewers?

[sawsee5]

Hey J.D.H, since you made the Terminator reference....wasn't the time travel device an electromagnetic something or other on that movie?? If so maybe that big electromagnet wasn't a giant bomb....maybe it opens the time portal and has to be reset every 108 minutes to keep the portal closed....when desmond put in the key he was already going through time, but he stopped everyone else on the island from going through....just a thought

The "portal" idea totally supports why the plane crashed, as the portal was closed because of the missed button-pushing. :blink:

[TinkerbellAPixie]

Hi All! The nakedness seems quite symbolic so labelling it as a 're-birth' makes a lot of sense. Or was ABC just trying to increase viewers?

It's quite possible - but they would have gained more viewers if it was naked Sawyer (or Kate for you fellas)

[sawsee5]

The movie with Bruce Willis, "The 12 Monkeys" reminds me of the Dez scenario. I'm a little hazy but I do remember Bruce's character was unsure what was real, a flashback or a dream.

I still like the idea that Dez did not really go back in time but 'remembered', in a dream (or a room 23 induced nightmare), an experience back in England coupled with his new experiences on the Lost island. :confused1:

Does that make any sense at all!!

[sawsee5]

It's quite possible - but they would have gained more viewers if it was naked Sawyer (or Kate for you fellas)

It certainly added a dramatic affect for Hurley and the women viewers!

[TinkerbellAPixie]

The movie with Bruce Willis, "The 12 Monkeys" reminds me of the Dez scenario. I'm a little hazy but I do remember Bruce's character was unsure what was real, a flashback or a dream.

I still like the idea that Dez did not really go back in time but 'remembered', in a dream (or a room 23 induced nightmare), an experience back in England coupled with his new experiences on the Lost island. :confused1:

Does that make any sense at all!!

It does make sense. I am with you in thinking it's dream or remembrance or some combination. But that doesn't explain his ability to foresee things....

It certainly added a dramatic affect for Hurley and the women viewers!

Poor Hurley - he has been through so much and now a naked Desmond on top of all his other traumas. :bored:

[Pekmboyd]

Hi. So Desmond wakes up naked in the jungle. And now it looks like he may have traveled back in time, if only mentally and not physically. So, what was up with the nakedness? I know in the Terminator movies that all the men who came from the future were naked when they appeared in the present. And the pop culture referrences are all over the place on this show. So do you think the nakedness lends to Desmond travelling through time?
Honsetly, I'm confused and don't know what to think.

I like to think he just had snaps and zippers on his clothes and the magnet sucked them off but that doesn't explain his underwear. Maybe they just got caught on his pants. :) I tend to skew toward the more goofy Lost theories, you might say.

The Terminator reference is a good one. Inanimate objects can't transport thru time or something like that. What I wanna know is he still flashing the past and is ahead of everyone by days or weeks ??? and when he turned that key, did the magnetic force cease to exist totally or just for a moment and now it is permanently in place. Does that make any sense at all???

It does...I think if there's some sort of portal in time, the button pushing was keeping it closed, it opened briefly when the plane crashed, and turning the key closed it permanently. Which would explain why they didn't want to turn the key unless they had to, you wouldn't want to cut off that opportunity for good without knowing what it could be used for someday.

Hi Tink.
That's a really interesting and heavy on the symbolism! Cool.
I have question about that episode - charlie was deafened, Locke couldn't speak, and it looked like Eko (who I really miss on the show, greatest backstory of any character) seemd to have been blinded, if only slightly. What is the meaning of those monkeys that have their mouths, eyes an ears covered? Because that's what I thought of immediately. Anyone else?

I hadn't thought of that. I miss Eko's character, but I wasn't all that bummed when he was killed off. I seemed to have a particularly hard time understanding what he was saying - something about the deepness of his voice was like a frequency I couldn't hear very well and it drove me nuts.

Hey J.D.H, since you made the Terminator reference....wasn't the time travel device an electromagnetic something or other on that movie?? If so maybe that big electromagnet wasn't a giant bomb....maybe it opens the time portal and has to be reset every 108 minutes to keep the portal closed....when desmond put in the key he was already going through time, but he stopped everyone else on the island from going through....just a thought

Totally. Which explains why the hatch IMploded instead of EXploded. Doesn't explain that flying Quarantine door landing on the beach, but since when can we explain everything??

[LOSTbean]

hey all! i've sorta scanned the posts real quickly today and i think i saw a post over at EW (or was it here? this is what happens when i scan posts, as well as the pre-alzheimers state i am pretty sure i am in) that maybe the direction desmond turned the fail safe key would affect if he went either forward or backwards in time. any thoughts on this?

[TinkerbellAPixie]

hey all! i've sorta scanned the posts real quickly today and i think i saw a post over at EW (or was it here? this is what happens when i scan posts, as well as the pre-alzheimers state i am pretty sure i am in) that maybe the direction desmond turned the fail safe key would affect if he went either forward or backwards in time. any thoughts on this?

OOH - gosh that hadn't occurred to me either. Damn I wanna see what happens when he turns it the other way.

But wait - if he is seeing Charlie die and is going back to save him over and over again, he sorta is going forwards and backwards? Maybe?

[pearlblackdragon]

hey all! i've sorta scanned the posts real quickly today and i think i saw a post over at EW (or was it here? this is what happens when i scan posts, as well as the pre-alzheimers state i am pretty sure i am in) that maybe the direction desmond turned the fail safe key would affect if he went either forward or backwards in time. any thoughts on this?

ooohhh....good one...i hadn't thought of that but if they had figured out time travel, one would assume that it could be in either direction....now I have something else to ponder....

[LOSTbean]

tink-i sorta feel like des has been repeating these "tours" on the island and each time it ends up in him turning that key and so sometimes he goes forward in time (i know, i know, the producers have said time travel does not happen on this show, so that totally blows this theory) andand sometimes he goes back. that's how this week's ep felt...i never knew if he was in the present, past, or future...

[Pekmboyd]

tink-i sorta feel like des has been repeating these "tours" on the island and each time it ends up in him turning that key and so sometimes he goes forward in time (i know, i know, the producers have said time travel does not happen on this show, so that totally blows this theory) andand sometimes he goes back. that's how this week's ep felt...i never knew if he was in the present, past, or future...

The producers said there's no time travel?? :blink: Well now I'm totally confused. Was the whole thing just a concussive hallucination?? (Which actually makes me feel better, I'm not really into the supernatural side of things, so time travel bugs me, but still....)

[jampony]

I have to ask for forgiveness in advance for what I'm about to say. I hate when people do this, but we've been discussing the last two episodes so much and there's just so much to remember...

Anyway, here goes. Somebody recently said that the producers said everything can be explained scientifically, so a lot of these cool theories may be way off the mark. I sincerely hope the explanations are (for lack of a better word) paranormal in nature, 'cause I like scifi-ish stuff, but if it's true that they're not, I truly cannot come up with anything that can explain all this weird crap that's been going on. Any thoughts on "normal" explanations?

Oh, and did anyone read this week's Ausiello? Some interesting near-spoilers and, also, he says five semi-important questions will be answered soon.

PS: It's the "somebody said" thing that drives me crazy; just go back and figure out who said it. I did try but couldn't find it. So I'm sorry that I just used that phrase :unsure2:

[J.D.H.]

I like to think he just had snaps and zippers on his clothes and the magnet sucked them off but that doesn't explain his underwear. Maybe they just got caught on his pants. :) I tend to skew toward the more goofy Lost theories, you might say.

I think Dez is the commando kinda guy. Heck they all maybe going commando. Dez gives off a real hippie/jesus vibe. For some reason (other than Dez saving Charlie) I can see Charlie following Dez everywhere.

PearlBD - the EM energy blast is exactly what I thought of too with Dez and the Terminators.

[Pekmboyd]

I think Dez is the commando kinda guy.


I love you.

[J.D.H.]

The black smoke monster could be to the Fire Station, as the EM field was to the Swan Station. Remember when Dez or anyone didn't press the button the EM field would release, what if the black smoke monster is only released when someone doesn't press the button in time OR doesn't press it on purpose, maybe because the 815 survivors come to close to the Fire Station. And I'm saying Fire Station and black smoke monster are connected because in mind - where there's smoke there's fire (or Flame). And I'd bet good money that Eye-Patch guy is located in the Flame Station, and he wasn't too friendly or like the intrusion.

If the black smoke monster is only released when someone doesn't press the button, it makes sense then that the monster's appearance has been so random.

And maybe it's the same with the whispers in the jungle, the randomness of it and seem to be released thoughts or psychic phenomenon.

[Ms. Tumnus]

The black smoke monster could be to the Fire Station, as the EM field was to the Swan Station. Remember when Dez or anyone didn't press the button the EM field would release, what if the black smoke monster is only released when someone doesn't press the button in time OR doesn't press it on purpose, maybe because the 815 survivors come to close to the Fire Station. And I'm saying Fire Station and black smoke monster are connected because in mind - where there's smoke there's fire (or Flame). And I'd bet good money that Eye-Patch guy is located in the Flame Station, and he wasn't too friendly or like the intrusion.

If the black smoke monster is only released when someone doesn't press the button, it makes sense then that the monster's appearance has been so random.


Dude, you're too smart. That sounds brilliant

[briolissima]

OK PearlBD, Pek, and JDH: we're all assuming that Desmond turned the key, the hatch imploded and the Des we see waking up naked in the jungle is the Des that just escaped from the hatch. Is it possible that in our 3-month episode- deprived state of mind we are missing the fact that something (or several somethings) may have happened in the interim, and the naked Des we see is naked for some other reason? Maybe saving our doomed Hobbit Charlie from fire or some other fate? Kind of a "Pulp Fiction" F-U to the traditional timeline of a story? And we all now know Des's timeline is really F'ed up!:unsure:

[J.D.H.]

It makes a certain kinda sense right? At least I thought so.
And before any EW regulars think I stole this off of a post(er) at the EW board - my nickname is Keoni. That was me over there. Everyone calls me Keoni. My initials are JDH, but Keoni is my name.

[Ms. Tumnus]

It makes a certain kinda sense right? At least I thought so.
And before any EW regulars think I stole this off of a post(er) at the EW board - my nickname is Keoni. That was me over there. Everyone calls me Keoni. My initials are JDH, but Keoni is my name.

Nice name. What's its origin?

[pearlblackdragon]

And maybe it's the same with the whispers in the jungle, the randomness of it and seem to be released thoughts or psychic phenomenon.

What if the whispers in the jungle aren't a psychic phenomenon but actual people......they are just on a different timeline. Or they are our losties and when said button forgets to be pushed a tear happens in the (cannot believe I am saying this) fabric of time....the voices our losties hear is themselves...just at a different time...

[Ellsbells]

It's quite possible - but they would have gained more viewers if it was naked Sawyer (or Kate for you fellas)

YUMM Nekkid Sawyer... *drools*
I'll take two! :tonguewag:

[Pekmboyd]

YUMM Nekkid Sawyer... *drools*
I'll take two! :tonguewag:

Lovely first post :thumbup:

[Ellsbells]

LOL thanks! I like to come out with a BANG (as in banging Sawyer...)

*drools again* :drool:

[TinkerbellAPixie]

LOL thanks! I like to come out with a BANG (as in banging Sawyer...)

*drools again* :drool:

Ladies and gentlemen, I present you with Ellsbells, my real life best friend.

LOL - as you can see she's not shy!

And J.D.H. I love the name Keoni - very cool name :thumbup:

[Ellsbells]

Ladies and gentlemen, I present you with Ellsbells, my real life best friend.

LOL - as you can see she's not shy!



LOL Nope not shy at all!:shifty:

[sawsee5]

What if the whispers in the jungle aren't a psychic phenomenon but actual people......they are just on a different timeline. Or they are our losties and when said button forgets to be pushed a tear happens in the (cannot believe I am saying this) fabric of time....the voices our losties hear is themselves...just at a different time...

Hello Keoni/Pearl and all! A lot of cool thoughts. My latest brain-twister revolves around the psychic and his daughter that 'comes back to life' (the 'miracle' that Eko investigates). This theme of 're-birth' has continued, throughout the show, and I now wonder if the daughter experienced a similar 're-birth' as Dez?
In Widmore's office there was a painting which I thought was Michael's but now believe it was painted by Claire's boyfriend. I have to re-watch that episode, but her painter boyfriend is, I believe, very involved with the Others. :scared: Does this "tear in the fabric" (quoting Pearl) allow one to slip through and be re-born?

[J.D.H.]

hi sawsee!!
I wondered if the psychic's daughter return from death wasn't a setup for jack's dad's return to the land of living. He hadn't been dead long, what with the rush to get on the plane and all. Seems a stretch though. Not very likely.

Maybe these appearances - black horse, Jack's dad (anyone or anything else?) are a totally seperate phenomenon from the black smoke monster. Maybe Eko's brother's appearance isn't part of the black smoke monster either. I don't know.

[Crazy4Lost]

I have a few things to throw out there as I just re-read all the posts and didn't see these, may or may not be significant.

As far as Desmond, this would have to be at a minimum his
3rd time to to "relive" this point in time. The reason I say this is because on his 1st time he would have seen Charlie die from the lightning, so on his 2nd time around he saved Charlie from the lightning but saw him drown saving Claire. So this time he saves him from both.

I'm not good at researching, so I thought maybe someone would or has looked into the name "Jimmy Lennon". That's the guy that comes into the pub with the cricket bat. With all the other name associations there are in the show, I thought maybe this too may be significant.

Ok, this may be absolutely nothing, but I noticed the pin the jeweler was wearing when she & Desmond were sitting outside. It is kind of unusual and noticable. Maybe someone will recognize it as a symbol of something.

[sawsee5]

I have a few things to throw out there as I just re-read all the posts and didn't see these, may or may not be significant.

As far as Desmond, this would have to be at a minimum his
3rd time to to "relive" this point in time. The reason I say this is because on his 1st time he would have seen Charlie die from the lightning, so on his 2nd time around he saved Charlie from the lightning but saw him drown saving Claire. So this time he saves him from both.

I'm not good at researching, so I thought maybe someone would or has looked into the name "Jimmy Lennon". That's the guy that comes into the pub with the cricket bat. With all the other name associations there are in the show, I thought maybe this too may be significant.

Ok, this may be absolutely nothing, but I noticed the pin the jeweler was wearing when she & Desmond were sitting outside. It is kind of unusual and noticable. Maybe someone will recognize it as a symbol of something.

Hi c4L & JDH! Great observations c4L! That totally makes sense: Des knows something is going to happen because he has 'seen' it before! The antique seller has a serpent-looking brooch. Does that tie into the medical symbol somehow? I'll have to do some searching for Jimmy Lennon! Thanks!



Jdh! I agree, I'm not sure what has been 'set up' and what is real?? I like your comment that the smoke monster was related/contained somehow to the button pushing.

[sawsee5]

Jimmy Lennon: He was a famous 'ring' announcer for boxing.
He announced for many famous boxing matches including 'Rocky'. He was the Uncle of the Lennon Sisters: "Lemon tree very pretty..."

Is 'ring' announcer a correlation?

[sawsee5]

Flashes: In room 23 we see 'flashes' of images being fed to Karl; Dez remarks about the 'flashes' he sees of his life. Maybe Dez was subjected to rm. 23 before being dumped on the beach??:confused:

Will Karl now have the same ability as Dez?

I read a comment that the crossword puzzle that Jack was working on was from 2006.

[J.D.H.]

Will Karl now have the same ability as Dez?

I think karl will go schizo on the 815 survivors. They've set it up for him to be totally unreliable and unstable.
He'll get along really well with Danielle.